Episode 106: How the Right Words Will Elevate Your Business (And Your Bottom Line) with Kamala Nair
We all know that we are in a very visual industry. Photos and images are eye-catching, but the written word is still needed in interior design. Your designs may be beautiful, but how are you differentiating yourself from other designers when people visit your website?
My next guest is Kamala Nair. She is a meticulous copywriter, brand voice expert, and acclaimed novelist with twenty years of professional writing experience. Kamala believes that interior design is much deeper than what we see on the surface, and there are so many stories that just looking at a beautiful photograph can't tell. Great copywriting has the power to elevate your brand and grow your business.
In this episode, we chat about ways to use words to stand out from other designers, the difference between writing your own copy and using a professional copywriter, and how interior designers can use copywriting to create a waitlist of clients.
Booking link: https://calendly.com/kamala-4/intro-chat
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Michelle Lynne: Welcome to Designed for the Creative Mind, a podcast for interior designers and creative entrepreneurs to run their business with purpose, efficiency, and passion. Because, while every design is different, the process should remain the same. Prepare yourself for some good conversations with amazing guests, a dash of Jesus and a touch of the woowoo, and probably a swear word or two. If you're ready to stop trading your time for money and enjoy your interior design business, you are in the right place. I'm your host, Michelle Lynne.
Michelle Lynne: Welcome back to the podcast everyone. I'm excited to have you here. I want to introduce today's guest, Kamala Nair. She is a copywriter and brand voice expert for the home and design industry. And y'all, she's a little modest because she wrote out her bio for me, but she's also a published author and she's written for publications, shelter magazines, such as Lux, Architectural Digest, and so forth. So not only do we have a copywriter, but we have an individual who's a pro and a little modest. So Kamala, thanks for being here. I just had to toot your horn. I'm so excited for you.
Kamala Nair: Oh, thank you so much, Michelle. I'm really, really excited and happy to be here.
Michelle Lynne: Absolutely. Well, let's just dig in, honey. So we're talking about copywriting, for the most part today. Our industry is so visually driven. When I'm talking to designers and they're talking about getting clients and stuff like that, most of our thoughts go to images. Why are words so critical?
Kamala Nair: That's a great question, Michelle. And there's no doubt that the photography is the number one most valuable asset for an interior designer. Like, photography is so important. But the reason that words are so critical is because great interior design is so much deeper than what you can see on the surface. So there are so many stories that just looking at a picture, a beautiful photograph, just can't tell. So if I'm looking at an image of a room, I can't see that the designer carefully selected every piece in that room based on their client's life experience or a personal story, and really imbued every piece in that room with deep significance. Or I can't see from looking at that image that all the beautiful fabrics that were selected, were chosen not only for their beauty, but also so that they could be pet and kid friendly. Or, you know, I can't see by looking at an image that the designer completed the project on budget and on the right timeline. So there are so many really important stories that just can't be told by looking at an image. And, you know, it's such a competitive industry, there are so many designers out there with beautiful photography, and using the right words and storytelling can really elevate you and differentiate you. And it can make all the difference between someone choosing to book a call with you or just moving on.
Michelle Lynne: That makes sense because it gives you insight behind the pretty picture.
Kamala Nair: Exactly.
Michelle Lynne: So why do we need to hire a copywriter? Like, if I know my design better than anybody because I've been living, breathing, and eating it for the last six months, nine months, however long, why do you suggest having a professional copywriter come in and do that translation?
Kamala Nair: Yeah, that's also a really good question. You know, a lot of interior designers do try to DIY their own copy. And the problem that kind of comes up is that a lot of the language just ends up being very generic and repetitive. Like, if you look at a lot of interior design websites out there, how many of them say modern, classic, you know, mid-century, like they're just very focused on using the same words. And also, the thing that a copywriter does is they have this special ability and this strategy that involves speaking directly to the ideal client. So it's not about just saying me, I do this, I do this, it's about really zeroing in on that customer and understanding what their pain points are. Understanding what they want, what their deep, burning desires are and really being able to boil that down and articulate it.
Michelle Lynne: That makes sense. And also, I think because personally, when I'm so close to something, it's hard to step out and look at it objectively.
Kamala Nair: Exactly, yeah.
Michelle Lynne: And using a lot of our, I don't know, say for interior design, probably just a lot of the words that we use associated with the industry, like sofa versus couch. You know, in my opinion, the average reader, our clients, are going to call it a couch, whereas internally, in the design industry, we call it a sofa. So those are some areas that I learned, growing up in my business, because I thought, hey, I'm a good writer, I can do this. And then I saw some of the work that a professionally paid copywriter submitted, I was like, oh, Michelle, give it up, honey. Give it up.
Kamala Nair: It's true. And, you know, even if I'm trying to write about myself, like, as you pointed out, like, in my little bio that I wrote for you, I didn't mention that I'm a novelist. Like, it's really hard for us to have that distance and be able to see yourself from that perspective that's necessary to put yourself out there, you know? For your clients.
Michelle Lynne: Yeah. The things that we just take for granted.
Kamala Nair: Exactly.
Michelle Lynne: Yeah, this is what I did. I just wrote a novel that's on Amazon and all the things. So, so cool. All right. So from a business standpoint, I would want to know, how does copywriting or how does good copy create clients? Like, how does that translate? I want to waitlist. How does that work?
Kamala Nair: How do you get a waitlist? Let's answer that. So the first thing that you really need to do, Michelle is you need to capture the email addresses of people who are visiting your website.
Michelle Lynne: Amen.
Kamala Nair: So that's the number one thing that you need to do. Because you can have the most beautiful website with the most wonderful copy and everything can be, you know, optimized and exactly what you want and what you need. But if you're not actually capturing the traffic that's coming to your site, then you're letting your ideal clients walk out the door every day. So that's the number one most important thing. And the way that you capture and collect email addresses is through having a very compelling, valuable opt in on your website. And so that's another thing that I see a lot. I see a lot of interior designers who just have like a subscribe to my email newsletter. Like a little box. And that's not really very enticing, you know?
Michelle Lynne: No, because whose email inbox isn't just overflowing already.
Kamala Nair: Exactly. Like anything that just asks me to subscribe, I immediately click away from that.
Michelle Lynne: Exactly.
Kamala Nair: So the way that you want to entice people to actually sign up is you want to provide them with something really valuable, a really valuable piece of content. And what that piece of content is, is going to be really specific to your brand and to your ideal client. But the main thing is that it needs to speak directly to that ideal client, and it needs to be something that's going to be really valuable to them. So it could, you know, if you're a client is really focused on you know, budget, for example, you could create like, a budget guide or an investment guide. Or if your client is really into vintage finds and flea markets, you could do like a guide to how to shop the flea market. Like, those are just ideas off the top of my head, but there's a million different things that you could do. There are different ways you could do it. You could do a video, you could do a downloadable PDF, but the main point is, it's got to have a wow factor.
Michelle Lynne: Yeah, if you're going to be invited into my inbox, it needs to be something a little sexy.
Kamala Nair: Exactly.
Michelle Lynne: No, that makes sense.
Michelle Lynne: Imagine trying to bake a cake without a recipe. You kind of know what the ingredients are, but you don't know how to put it all together. After lots of hard work and trying different combinations, all you are left with is a sticky situation and a stomachache. Babe, running an interior design business can feel exactly that same way. That is why I created The Interior Design Business Bakery. This is a program that teaches you how to bake your interior design business cake and eat it too. If you don't want to figure out the hard way, and you want guidance to follow, a recipe that has already been vetted, someone that has already been there and done it and will help you do it too, then check out the year-long mentorship and coaching program, The Interior Design Business Bakery. If your interior design business revenue is below $300,000, or if you're struggling to make a profit and keep your sanity, this is the only program for you. You can find that information at designedforthecreativemind.com/business-bakery. Check it out. You won't regret it.
Michelle Lynne: And so you're, I totally agree with you. Because some of the things that I teach in my paid program, the Interior Design Business Bakery, is literally, you do not own your social media followers. If Meta goes down, how are you going to attract clients? Or how are you going to, you know, get any phone calls. And it is, it's your email list. That sucker needs to be primary focus in your marketing.
Kamala Nair: Oh, yes. And it's so much more personal and intimate than social media. And so the second thing that you want to do once you've captured those email addresses, is that you want to actually email them regularly.
Michelle Lynne: Don't just sit on them and let them get dusty.
Kamala Nair: Exactly. Or send something you know, every six months or something. You want to really, especially in the first 90 days after you've captured their email address, because that's when you're really going to be top of mind and when their interest is going to be highest. So you want to be sending them really engaging, I like to send very magazine-style, engaging, beautiful emails that are really going to nurture, not only nurture your audience, but to sort of educate them about who you are as a designer and, you know what the process is like of working with you or working with an interior designer in general. And really just kind of nurturing them through this arc so that by the end of that 90-day period, they feel like they know you, they know your work, and they're ready to book a call with you. And then the final piece is, you know, you've basically been nurturing this waitlist by sending these emails regularly, and then when the time comes that you have a spot open, and you're kind of looking to get that next client, all you have to do is send an invitation to your email list for them to book a call with you. And they're already nurtured. They're already there. They're ready to buy.
Michelle Lynne: Right. I think that's great. So if they don't book a call, they're just not quite ready. Maybe they know they're going to be kicking off a project a year from now. Are you just going dark or are you having an evergreen email list or something?
Kamala Nair: Oh, yeah, I recommend having an evergreen email list and just continuing. So that first 90-day period is sort of the crucial period where you want to be sending emails, probably weekly, I would suggest and then after that, you can kind of ease up a little bit, maybe you send your emails bi-weekly. But the point is, you just want to stay in touch, and you want to stay top of mind. And the other thing I want to emphasize is I actually really hate the word newsletter because it's like the unsexiest word, right?
Michelle Lynne: Yeah, what do you use instead?
Kamala Nair: So I don't have another word for it. But I want to bring it up just to say, just because it's called a newsletter, it doesn't mean you have to make it a newsletter. It doesn't have to just be like, here's my news, here's my latest project. Like, it needs to be engaging to get people to actually read it and to actually engage with it. It needs to be high quality and you need to be delivering value, whether it's inspiration or tips, or whatever it is. And also sprinkle it through with your portfolio images, because that's important as well.
Michelle Lynne: So I'm sitting here thinking, Oh, my gosh, I thought I had all of this covered. And now I'm thinking, oh, shoot, I'm gonna have to go back and review what I have going on. Because it is, it's so much more than just one and done.
Kamala Nair: Exactly. Yeah.
Michelle Lynne: So here's another question. I come across individuals who just want to make their website pretty with just their images. And, you know, just this beautiful layout and the colors and just the branded website. And they don't want to put words on it because obviously it's not as pretty. But what do you say to designers who want like very little copy or none?
Kamala Nair: Yeah, I mean, that is something that I do come across because again, it is such a visual industry and there is this appeal to have, you know, a lot of designers have a very minimalist style just in the way they design a room, so they want that same feel on their websites. I do understand that, but it kind of goes back to that place of being able to differentiate yourself and being able to stand out from the crowd. Because there are going to like, again, there are going to be a lot of interior designers who have really beautiful portfolios and amazing photography and, you know, maybe even a similar style to what you have. And the words are really the only thing that you have to differentiate yourself and make yourself stand out in this really saturated market. And then again, to tell not only those stories that we talked about before, but there's so much else that goes into the interior design process. There's the experience that you offer, there's the rapport that you have with your clients, there's your personality, the way you work. Are you good at time management? Are you going to manage the project? Like, there are so many aspects that if you can make those clear through words on your website, you're going to put yourself way ahead of the competition.
Michelle Lynne: And I love that you said to let your personality out, because one of the things that I learned later in life, you know, a few years into my interior design business, was that nobody else is you, nobody else is me. And people, like you said, I might have a similar aesthetic as the designer down the street, but they're gonna hire me based on my personality. They're gonna hire you based on your personality. But if there's no personality on your website, they're not, I don't know, it'd be hard to make a decision as to who to pick up the phone and call first.
Kamala Nair: Exactly. But it's like, you're in such an advantageous position if they already know, they already have the answers to those questions, they already have a sense of your personality before you even get on that call. Because then they've probably already decided that they want to work, like they have all the information already and the call is just this like formality. Whereas if they don't know anything about you, and they have just seen your beautiful work on a minimalist website, then they get on the phone with you, and they have all these questions, and they're at a very different stage of that buying process.
Michelle Lynne: Yeah, and I also think that like, for my team, we have a very unique voice, you know, we're a little fun, I personally am a little quirky, so that kind of carries down. And we don't take ourselves real seriously, even though we take business seriously. And I think that that needs to be in all of our copy. Because if somebody calls and expects me to be oh, so very proper, you know, and I answer the phone and I'm not, I'm myself, it would be completely a waste of their time, it would almost be uncomfortable. And just being able to show a little bit of personality has been very freeing for me as an individual, as a business owner, and as a designer.
Kamala Nair: That's such a great point. Because it's not just about who you're attracting, or it's not just about putting yourself out there for your clients. But it's also about filtering what's coming in to you. So it's advantageous for you as well, because you're getting people who are gonna respond to your personality, like, those are the calls that you're going to be getting.
Michelle Lynne: I think, like, you attract people. So attracting your ideal client, different partners, and things along that line, it just makes such a difference. It reminds me, it's kind of like a match.com, right, like, back in the day, I'm really dating myself. I think it's just called Match now, or there's like all the other Tinders and stuff like that, but I'm not familiar with it. But it's like, you write this bio of who you are, right? And then you show up as somebody completely different, the clients are going to know that and they're not going to want to hire you. It's like you said that you were, you know, six foot three and had a full head of hair, look at those pictures. And then you show up and you're five four and you're bald, right?
Kamala Nair: Totally. Totally.
Michelle Lynne: It's just gonna be, I mean, that's a little extreme. But I think it's important that the client kind of has an idea of reality before they call.
Kamala Nair: Totally. And I love what you said about attract because it really is about like attracting your ideal client and drawing them to you. And when you get the words right on your website and in your email marketing, you're literally, well not literally, but you're metaphorically drawing those ideal clients to you like a magnet because you're speaking directly to them. And that's what really makes all the difference.
Michelle Lynne: And to take it a step back, I think you also have to know who your ideal client is. Because you cannot, and I can imagine that you've probably come across this on occasion, when you're working with a client, such as myself, it's like, who's your ideal client? Because you can't write to appeal to everybody.
Kamala Nair: Totally. Yeah.
Michelle Lynne: You need to be speaking to your people, if it's, you know, a bachelor, or if it's athletes, or if it's soccer moms or whoever the case may be or professionals, just all the things, you can't, I mean, just those four are so completely differently positioned. It would just be confusing on the website otherwise.
Kamala Nair: Yeah, it would be confusing. And, yeah, it's just you sort of start wading into that territory of generic when you're trying to talk to everyone, and then you end up getting no one because you're not really speaking to anyone, and it's just your message is just very nonspecific.
Michelle Lynne: And it's almost backwards, where you have to niche down a little bit in order to elevate.
Kamala Nair: Yeah.
Michelle Lynne: Because otherwise, yeah, it's just confusing.
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Michelle Lynne: Okay, so here's a question for you. So we were talking about email lists, and we were talking about like the first 90 days, and then the evergreen and so forth. Do you suggest having another campaign I think is the right word, another marketing campaign for clients who have been, for individuals who have signed a contract and move forward with you, because you'll obviously take them off your evergreen sales content. Do you just drop them into another bucket?
Kamala Nair: Yeah, I'm so glad you asked that. Because that's really important. Because we often are so focused on getting the clients and we don't think about what to do with the people who are already working with us. And you definitely don't want to just drop them, you want to keep nurturing that relationship. Because you don't only want to nurture it because you hope that they might come back and have you do another project, but that's also a really key source for referrals. And if you're keeping them updated with what's been going on and you're nurturing that relationship, they're going to be so much more likely to refer you. So you would definitely move them into a different kind of track. And the focus would be more on nurturing that relationship rather than persuading them to take action and book a call with you.
Michelle Lynne: That makes sense. And it's so true, because I just had a client contact me via email, and Kamala, I don't know when I actually worked with this individual. He was like, here's a picture of my house. I was like, I kind of recognize your house, I don't really recognize your name, I had to go back and look, and it was like from 2017. But I guess he's still on my email list.
Kamala Nair: That's awesome. I love it.
Michelle Lynne: Well, it's that 24-hour marketing that you don't even realize is going out behind the scenes. So it's, it's like, it's a lot of work on the front end. A lot of work on the front end, but you can put it in place. How often would you suggest updating your copy? Like your email list, copy stuff? And heck, your website copy?
Kamala Nair: Yeah, well, so let's start with email. And you're exactly right. The thing that's so brilliant about this is that so many interior designers, like all of you, you're so busy, you don't have time to be constantly posting on social media, and you know, doing all of these other marketing things. So doing the email list, it is a big investment upfront, whether you're hiring someone, or you're doing it yourself, there is an upfront investment.
Michelle Lynne: Which is not recommended.
Kamala Nair: Which is not recommended. Exactly. So there is that investment. But once you've made that investment, it's set it and forget it. Like, you can have a year of emails written and uploaded into your system. And you can have your website copy done and your opt in. And it's basically just this 24/7 salesperson who's working behind the scenes for you, as you said. So like while you're out there doing your brilliant designs, while you're going on vacation or sleeping at night, there's constantly this marketing force that's working for you and bringing clients in. So it's amazing, really. And I would suggest, I like to do up to a year of emails. So I think that's something that you could do upfront and just like set it and forget it. So I would say, if you did something like that, you could maybe update it every year, and then maybe you occasionally do some in between if you want to talk about a recent project that you didn't have photographs before.
Michelle Lynne: That makes sense.
Kamala Nair: And in terms of updating your website, I think you definitely need to be updating your portfolio regularly. And then, you know, I think there isn't really a cut and dry answer. Like I can't say, you know, every interior designer should do this, you know, every two years, it's really going to depend on how you feel about, do you, I guess I would ask yourself the question, is my website accurately capturing my talent and my genius? And is it capturing? And am I attracting the kinds of clients that I want to be attracting? Am I attracting my dream clients? And if the answer to either of those questions is no, then it's time to update your website.
Michelle Lynne: I think that's great. And oftentimes, we get itchy to keep things pretty. But at the same time, you know, if it doesn't lend to a full website makeover, you know, just getting the assistance from a professional to ensure that it is reflective of what you're doing. But also, I think that email list, and that email marketing campaign is huge. So yeah, they do go hand in hand. I'm gonna have to go back and look at what I've got going on right now.
Kamala Nair: One question that I think is very helpful because a lot of people are like, okay, well, what are the right words? How do I actually know what to say to differentiate myself? And one question that I tell people, you know, to just kind of get started to think about what they can say to differentiate themselves, is when a client learns blank about my work, they have to hire me, like, what is that thing? What is that it factor for your brand that as soon as someone finds out that you do this or whatever it is about your work, you need to identify that and make sure that that's front and center on your homepage and across your marketing platforms.
Michelle Lynne: Oh, that's fantastic. Yeah. And that is a simple question. But again, it goes back to individuals, we're not as good at extracting that from ourselves. So if y'all are not in a place to hire a copywriter, then go back and ask your previous clients what some of those things are, but also, you know, the people around you might be able to give you some insight because they can look at you a little bit more objectively than we look at ourselves.
Kamala Nair: So true.
Michelle Lynne: Awesome. I love that. Can you repeat that? When a client learns blank about my work, they can't not hire me?
Kamala Nair: Yeah, basically. When a client learns blank about my work, they have to hire me.
Michelle Lynne: Oh, there you go. I love that. Thank you for sharing. Oh, girl, there is so much that we could talk about. I love talking about all things business related. But this is the point in our episode, where I like to have a little extra fun.
Kamala Nair: Okay.
Michelle Lynne: And it is just a rapid-fire Q&A session.
Kamala Nair: Okay.
Michelle Lynne: So we'll start off simple. Do you have an innie belly button or an outie belly button?
Kamala Nair: Innie.
Michelle Lynne: What is your favorite productivity hack?
Kamala Nair: The Pomodoro Method. Do you know what that is?
Michelle Lynne: Yes. I didn't know it was called the Pomodoro Method until a few years ago. But yeah, that is genius.
Kamala Nair: Yeah.
Michelle Lynne: If you guys don't know what the Pomodoro Method is, long story short, it is working in increments like of two hours and then you take a break for 15 minutes, and then another two hours and 15 minutes. And it came to term, Pomodoro Method because I think the person who coined that term, was using a tomato kitchen timer to do that at their desk.
Kamala Nair: Exactly.
Michelle Lynne: Is that about right? Yeah, so it definitely works, and it keeps you focused. What did you want to be when you were growing up?
Kamala Nair: This may sound a little cheesy, but I always wanted to be a writer.
Michelle Lynne: Oh, that's awesome. Well, it worked.
Kamala Nair: Yeah. I manifested it.
Michelle Lynne: There you go. And the audience here, they're here with me so cheesy is kind of one of the key words here. We don't take ourselves too seriously. Yes, you did manifest it. Any other books in your process that you're working on these days?
Kamala Nair: Yes. I'm working on my second novel. And it's been a long process, because it's something I'm kind of just doing on the side alongside the business. But yeah, I'm working on a historical novel at the moment about Mary Shelley, the author of Frankenstein.
Michelle Lynne: That's exciting. I love historical fiction. It's fictional?
Kamala Nair: Yes, it is. It's fictional.
Michelle Lynne: Oh, very cool. I will be on the wait list. What is the best compliment you've ever received?
Kamala Nair: Oh, that is a hard one. You know, it's probably just my, I have two little kids. I have a three-year-old and a four-year-old. And the other day I got all dressed up and like did my makeup and they were just both like, Mama, you're so beautiful.
Michelle Lynne: Oh, I love that.
Kamala Nair: And just hearing it from them, like from their innocent, young perspective, it just melted my heart.
Michelle Lynne: Yeah, I can appreciate that. And so you have a three and a four-year-old.
Kamala Nair: Yes.
Michelle Lynne: And you write books, and you have a job, like you do the copywriting and all the things. So yeah, no wonder your second novel is kind of taking its time.
Kamala Nair: Yeah. So I do need all the productivity hacks for sure.
Michelle Lynne: That makes sense. That makes sense. Okay, so what is your favorite book?
Kamala Nair: Oh, that's also a really hard question. I have like 30. I would say my number one favorite book is Wuthering Heights by Emily Bronte.
Michelle Lynne: Emily Bronte.
Kamala Nair: Yeah. I just love, I love 19th century British fiction and Victorians and all of that stuff. I was an English major in college so I'm kind of a book nerd at heart.
Michelle Lynne: Well, that works, that works. Do you have a favorite business book?
Kamala Nair: My favorite business book is, I don't know if this necessarily qualifies as business, but Atomic Habits. I think a lot of businesspeople refer to that. And that book was like mind blowing to me. And it just really shifted my perspective and the way I think about things, so I would definitely say that's my favorite.
Michelle Lynne: Yeah, that's crazy too, just building on it one little bit at a time. So where do you find inspiration?
Kamala Nair: Everywhere. Just looking around, like I'm a very keen observer. So just listening to conversations around me. You know, in the conversations that I have with my clients. I'm always finding nuggets of inspiration in the books that I read, in just going for a walk outside. I live in the Cotswolds in the UK, so it's really beautiful and scenic here. And so just walking around getting inspiration from nature, everywhere.
Michelle Lynne: Oh, that sounds lovely. And yes, it's I think you just have to be present sometimes in order to find some of that inspiration, literally at your fingertips. Okay, so Kamala, the last one is what would you pick for your last meal?
Kamala Nair: Pizza. I have to go with a classic.
Michelle Lynne: So you might live in the UK, but pizza is your answer.
Kamala Nair: Yeah, you can't beat it. It's just like the ultimate comfort food.
Michelle Lynne: Amen to that. Amen to that. Well, thank you so much for being on the show today.
Kamala Nair: Thank you so much for having me.
Michelle Lynne: I know that our audience has loved everything. Yeah, this has been fun. It's been a long time coming.
Kamala Nair: Yes.
Michelle Lynne: Just back and forth via email and stuff. So will you tell our audience how they can connect with you and where they can find you?
Kamala Nair: Yes, yeah. So they can connect with me on social media, my handle on Instagram and Twitter and LinkedIn is just my name. So Kamala Nair that's K-A-M-A-L-A-N-A-I-R. And they can also find me on my website, which is www.kamalanairinc.com. That's I-N-C. So yeah, they can feel free to DM me, or they can message me via my website. And I also wanted to just go ahead and, you know, I know that we've talked a lot about emails, and what kind of emails you should be sending and how often and I know that can be a really intimidating thing for people to process. So I'd love to offer anyone who's listening to this podcast, a complimentary implementation call with me, where I'd be happy to just talk through your specific business and how we can make this happen for your business.
Michelle Lynne: Oh, that's awesome. So thank you so much.
Kamala Nair: Yeah, I will share a link, you know, a booking link with you, Michelle, and you can share that with the audience.
Michelle Lynne: Rock on. So I will make sure that all of those details, your website, social handles, booking link, and all those things are in the show notes. So those will live forever.
Kamala Nair: Awesome.
Michelle Lynne: Absolutely. And for those of you who can benefit from even more resources surrounding the business of running your interior design business, join the growing community on my Facebook private group. It's called the Interior Designers Business Launchpad. And, of course, y'all, any reviews that you can leave for the podcast, wherever you listen to the podcast, is greatly appreciated. So thank you again, Kamala, for being here. And thank you to the listeners.
Kamala Nair: Thank you.
Michelle Lynne: Until next time.
Michelle Lynne: Hey, y'all. If you love the show and find it useful, I would really appreciate it if you would share with your friends and followers. And if you like what you're hearing, want to put a face with the name and get even more business advice, then join me in my Facebook group, the Interior Designers Business Launchpad. Yeah, I know it's Facebook, but just come on in for the training and then leave without scrolling your feed. It's fun. I promise you'll enjoy it. And finally, I hear it's good for business to get ratings on your podcast. So please drop yours on whatever platform you use to listen to this. We're all about community over competition, so let's work on elevating our industry, one designer at a time. See you next time.